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Post by thekid965 on Jun 9, 2015 15:13:47 GMT -5
If Peter Marshall didn't want to leave Fantasy to co-host the Hour, that would be quite ironic indeed; guess which show NBC cancelled to make room for the mash-up.
I always hate to see people hold grudges, especially after so many years have passed, especially when one of the participants in the grudge is no longer alive to tell their side of the story. In Bert's defense, perhaps his condition was adversely affecting his personality and judgment towards the end, which caused him to do what he did to Peter, in which case he can't be held completely responsible for it. Brain cancer is capable of causing peoples' personalities to do complete 180s. However, another factor that must be taken into account is, we don't know what Bert was like with his own production company versus just being the host, as he was on Tattletales or Super Password; by way of example, there are several stories about how Dick Clark was totally cool to work with on Pyramid but was sometimes described as the "boss from hell" when it came to running Dick Clark Productions. There's also the way Bob Barker's off-camera personality completely changed for the worse after he got full production control over Price, and need I even mention the name "Richard Dawson?"
Whether The 3rd Degree was a hit or a flop doesn't matter, though. At the end of the day, Peter was screwed out of a job in a field where jobs are difficult to come by, so it's only natural he'd still be bitter about it even now. But it's sad to see it all the same.
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Post by carpetcrawler on Jun 9, 2015 18:38:27 GMT -5
From the Wikipedia synopsis of MGHSH, for whatever that's worth. Which is, no offense, very little. Exactly, thekid. And let's not forget Allen Ludden, who we know now had a reputation of being a really nasty person when the cameras were off, screaming and cursing at staff members. And yeah, by all accounts Dick Clark really wasn't a nice person to deal with sometimes... Really, one of the few people in game shows that I don't think we've heard anything bad about is Bill Cullen, and possibly Garry Moore off the top of my head. At the end of the day, Peter was screwed out of a job in a field where jobs are difficult to come by, so it's only natural he'd still be bitter about it even now. But it's sad to see it all the same. This is the main point I was going for here. I feel like people were really quick to jump to Bert's defense because of his charming personality on-camera. Let's be real, other celebrities (even Bert's friends) often poked fun at Bert being kind of an airhead who cared more about what he looked like than his job. And I say this whilst loving and adoring Bert. But still, in a cutthroat field (don't forget how over-saturated we were in syndicated games at the time) he still screwed Peter out of a job and didn't even bother telling him personally. It was a lousy thing to do, and who knows if Bert had a track record of not being a very nice person otherwise. And sure, it could just be Peter with sour grapes (in his book he certainly has an inflated view on himself sometimes, granted he had some right to considering his track record, one of the few multi-win daytime Emmy winners for Best Game Show Host), but would it really surprise you if it were something else? The other person Peter admits to absolutely disliking is Dan Rowan. And why? Because Dan no-showed visiting a dying friend in the hospital, despite knowing the friend was in that hospital for a year and being in the vicinity the entire time. If Peter can put Bert at the same level as someone like that, then there is clearly more to this than we think, and I'm not sure I want to know what it is. |
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Post by WarioSajak on Jun 9, 2015 23:29:09 GMT -5
If Peter Marshall didn't want to leave Fantasy to co-host the Hour, that would be quite ironic indeed; guess which show NBC cancelled to make room for the mash-up. I've been of the belief that Peter was still under contract with Heatter. Marshall co-hosting the Hour wouldn't have solved all the issues with it (the big one was Goodson's idea that Squares could work like Match Game), but it definitely would've helped. There's also the way Bob Barker's off-camera personality completely changed for the worse after he got full production control over PriceBarker was kinda always like that, or at least since the 1970s. There's indication he despised Frank Wayne after the Price producer accidentally disqualified Barker from the Best Game Show Host Emmy in 1979; on said telecast, which Barker hosted, he announced his own disqualification and gave his home address so Dick Clark could send the Emmy to "its rightful winner". Whether The 3rd Degree was a hit or a flop doesn't matter, though. At the end of the day, Peter was screwed out of a job in a field where jobs are difficult to come by, so it's only natural he'd still be bitter about it even now. I don't think he was bitter about not getting the job (since he didn't like the show), but that Convy didn't have the balls to tell Peter face-to-face that he wanted to do the show himself. As you said, though, it's possible his condition was affecting his personality and judgment. All-Star Blitz was clearly a ripoff of the Hollywood Squares format and it showed in every single aspect. Just a poor show overall. I disagree, if only because it was done by Merrill Heatter, who also did Squares. Even then, by all indication Hot Numbers (the pilot that became All-Star Blitz) was way, way worse. The other person Peter admits to absolutely disliking is Dan Rowan. And why? Because Dan no-showed visiting a dying friend in the hospital, despite knowing the friend was in that hospital for a year and being in the vicinity the entire time. Which in turn is why Peter gunned for the Squares position after hearing that Rowan was also up for the hosting job, and also why Dick Martin was never on the show either. |
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Post by carpetcrawler on Jun 10, 2015 1:58:58 GMT -5
I've been of the belief that Peter was still under contract with Heatter. Marshall co-hosting the Hour wouldn't have solved all the issues with it (the big one was Goodson's idea that Squares could work like Match Game), but it definitely would've helped. Oh, absolutely. But at the same time there's also the slightest possible chance with Peter at the helm you have him going in Goodson's ear about why a non-scripted Squares wouldn't have worked... if only. Barker was kinda always like that, or at least since the 1970s. There's indication he despised Frank Wayne after the Price producer accidentally disqualified Barker from the Best Game Show Host Emmy in 1979; on said telecast, which Barker hosted, he announced his own disqualification and gave his home address so Dick Clark could send the Emmy to "its rightful winner". The generally accepted theory is that Dorothy Jo was the one who kept Bob's ego in check (he apparently genuinely didn't like kids that much, which made his run on Truth or Consequences interesting sometimes), and once she passed on there was no filter for Bob. But yeah, the Frank Wayne mishap is where people pinpoint when Bob's ego issues got a little over the line. The "rightful winner" stuff was clearly tongue-in-cheek, but amusing considering how bad Bob's ego issue would genuinely get in the future. Which in turn is why Peter gunned for the Squares position after hearing that Rowan was also up for the hosting job, and also why Dick Martin was never on the show either. Yeah, Peter LOVED Dick Martin and considered him a dear friend, but he knew everyone would be put in an awkward position if Dick was the only one invited to do the show and not Dan. Apparently Dick understood, knowing Dan had a bit of a reputation. The history of Laugh-In is pretty fascinating as well. Someone (Kliph Nesteroff?) wrote a pretty big exposé piece where he revealed that it was actually an extremely pro-Nixon conservative-leaning show (one of the lead writers was I think a Nixon speechwriter or something along those lines) considering its general acceptance as a "hip" hippie liberal show, when in turn it was really ironically mocking the left most of the time. |
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Post by thekid965 on Jun 10, 2015 10:09:27 GMT -5
▲ Y'know, getting off-topic for a sec, I always did wonder why Nixon, easily one of the most insecure Presidents ever when it came to criticism and opposition (cf. the infamous "enemies list" and the raison principale behind a certain hotel break-in), allowed himself to appear in person on a show that seemed to be routinely mocking everything he believed in and stood for. It would also explain why Laugh-In remained on the air as long as it did, while the not-dissimilar Smothers Brothers Comedy Hour on CBS was cancelled amidst a flood of conservative viewer complaints. If that story's accurate, it was because Laugh-In was merely pretending to embrace the leftist, antiwar youth culture as a means to poke fun at it (sort of a '60s, Bizarro World-style Stephen Colbert in that regard), whereas Dick and Tom were presenting the real deal.
Of course, Laugh-In ended up becoming championed by the very "hippies" it was supposed to be mocking and is to this day considered one of the essential counterculture TV shows of a decade largely defined by its counterculture. So if that was their intent, it would seem the last laugh was on them.
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Post by Kaos on Jun 17, 2015 18:56:43 GMT -5
Of course, Laugh-In ended up becoming championed by the very "hippies" it was supposed to be mocking and is to this day considered one of the essential counterculture TV shows of a decade largely defined by its counterculture. So if that was their intent, it would seem the last laugh was on them. You bet your sweet bippy. |
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